Left or right? Liberal or socialistic?

[TheImperialDragon]

I was talking world-wide.

[DarkAsmodeous]

He was talking from the view of an 8 year old,

[Psychotic]

Originally posted by TheImperialDragon
A society where everyone had equal rights would be nice, some may think that already's in place, and if that is so, then wake up and look around you. :O

Makes me think back to when I was 8-ish years old. How the world seemed like such a big friendly place back then... Unfortunately, I don't think it exists in this time we live in, and it may not be the worst of it, from what I see,

I think this is a perfect moment for my favorite proverb:
Ignorance is bliss.

[Mormacil]

Can't disagree on that one

[Siegfried]

Originally posted by Psychotic

Originally posted by TheImperialDragon
A society where everyone had equal rights would be nice, some may think that already's in place, and if that is so, then wake up and look around you. :O

Makes me think back to when I was 8-ish years old. How the world seemed like such a big friendly place back then... Unfortunately, I don't think it exists in this time we live in, and it may not be the worst of it, from what I see,

I think this is a perfect moment for my favorite proverb:
Ignorance is bliss.

So long as people leave you alone. When someone starts taking advantage of your ignorance though... then it's not so fun.

[Psychotic]

Originally posted by Siegfried

Originally posted by Psychotic

Originally posted by TheImperialDragon
A society where everyone had equal rights would be nice, some may think that already's in place, and if that is so, then wake up and look around you. :O

Makes me think back to when I was 8-ish years old. How the world seemed like such a big friendly place back then... Unfortunately, I don't think it exists in this time we live in, and it may not be the worst of it, from what I see,

I think this is a perfect moment for my favorite proverb:
Ignorance is bliss.

So long as people leave you alone. When someone starts taking advantage of your ignorance though... then it's not so fun.

Of course, if it only was so simple I would choose to be ignorant... though I obviously can't afford it (like most people) because of the reason you mentioned.

[raggidman]

Personally I believe that all parties are corrupt and all systems flawed - it don't really matter whch flaw any system / party has in general - so what is important is workin on the details rather than 'makin deals'.

This is not to say that I prefer anarchism, but rather to recognise what we are dealin with

Once you have that clear then pick an issue and do your best to influence it in the most positive direction

Avoid re-electing any candidate - and if I see a candidate re-elected I wonder if there is some kind of fix in.

Fight institutionalised corruption - where politicians reward themselves

Jail any politician who adopts a policy that causes death other than in defence of the state or individuals

De-link media from politics and business - no media ownership by politicians or commercial-industrial organisations -all newsorgans must be independant and advertising must be no more than 30% of content and 30% of income for newspapers and tv

All arms sales must be vetted by state officials and those officials monitored

The Universal Declaration of Human Rights must be used as a tool by all courts in all cases and governemnts must recognise that they are bound by it.

... more ...

The most dangerous politics are the politics of naivity - both Marx and Engels fall in that category - they had nice ideas in some respects, but they failed to objectively assess what the likely results of peoples' reactions to their ideas would be ... deadly ... and thereby they have created platforms for those who would enslave the common man

[DarkAsmodeous]

I don't entirely disagree with what you've said.... except for this.

"The Universal Declaration of Human Rights must be used as a tool by all courts in all cases and governemnts must recognise that they are bound by it."

I frankly do not WANT many of the "rights" granted to me by that document, and many of those "rights" infringe upon other rights.

I don't want a nationality.

I don't want to obligate another to surrender his labor and time to me to provide food, I'm NOT ethicaly OK with any of that.

[Cuthalion]

The problem with Marx is that he was a rich kid, he didn't know how the 'man in the street' thinks, nor how the masses can be manipulated by just one man with a strong voice in a time without television - although later on, offcourse, the television became the most important propaganda tool.

But what is really wrong with Marxism is the equality. There's no equality, people! I differ from DA, I differ from raggidman, I am NOT equal to them. I may be 'better', but exactly as likely is that I'm 'worse'.

However, to this world there are two factors to consider always: Genotype / Inherited Money (Corruption) and Discipline / Conviction (Competition). The first category is everything you could call an 'unfair advantage', see in this a man with 'big bones' running the hundred yards against a man with superior 'running-genes'. Or, an entrepreneur with his daddy's money to back him up and a guy from Harlem who wants to start a business.

The second category is what decreases the size of the gap between people, the guy with the superior 'running-genes' might not have the discipline to train, while the 'big bones' guy has trained for years because he had the Discipline, the Conviction to win from the other guy.

What happens if we put Marxism in place? That'll mean we take the second category away, totally and absolutely away since there is no need for Competition because "We're all equal already!". But we can't take the Genotype out of the equation, making Marxism only a hidden form of class-struggle.

[TheImperialDragon]

This thread is old and there were new board rules put into place since Psychotic's post. It's a somewhat fun topic for some people, but it's a very deep one for many more.